Welcome back, young scientists. I’m Dr. Universe. If you’re anything like me, you’ve got lots of big questions about our world.
Do you love insects? Me, too. In this episode, we meet Rich Zack, an insect scientist at Washington State University.
Resources You Can Use
As always, submit burning questions at askdruniverse.wsu.edu. Who knows where your questions will take us next.
Welcome back, young scientists. I’m Dr. Universe. If you’re anything like me, you’ve got lots of big questions about our world.
Do you love insects? Me, too. In this episode, we meet Rich Zack, an insect scientist at Washington State University.
Resources You Can Use
As always, submit burning questions at askdruniverse.wsu.edu. Who knows where your questions will take us next.
Dr. Universe
Hey, friends. I'm Dr. Universe. If you're anything like me, you've got lots of big questions about our world.
I get lots of questions about insects. And today I'm talking with an entomologist. That's an insect scientist. His name is Rich Zack, and I can't wait for you to hear what he has to say. Let's get started.
Can we first talk about what entomology is?
Rich Zack
Yeah. So, entomology is the study of insects and related animals. Most people, I think, can define an insect. It has six legs. It has three body parts. And they understand all of that. And they know some insects -- oh, butterflies and beetles. And yeah, those are all insects. But entomologists also tend to study a lot of other animals that belong in this phylum that we call Arthropoda.
So even though there are experts on spiders and experts on scorpions, those animals tend to fall into the general purview of entomology. The only arthropods that really don't are the marine arthropods -- the crustaceans, lobsters, crabs. All of those have their own science, marine biology. So, an entomologist can study insects for the most part, but we also provide a lot of the information on those groups.
Dr. Universe
And what kind of entomology do you personally do?
Rich Zack
I am probably best described as a general entomologist. I know that that doesn't help much. In the old days, I would have been referred to as a natural history entomologist. I also do taxonomy and systematics, which is the naming of insects and trying to understand their relatedness.
I like to go out and look at insects and try to figure out how they fit in to their environment. I do life history studies. So where are the eggs laid? Where do the immatures develop? You know, what's going on with the biology? What are the adults doing? How do the adults mate? And kind of put a story together about either a specific insect or a group of insects.
And then the other thing that I really enjoy doing is under the general term of biological diversity. I like to look at habitats and look at insects in those habitats, and then try to get a better understanding of that habitat. So, what are the insects doing there? Is this a habitat that is very specific to certain types of insects? Is it more of a generalized habitat? And we use a lot of that information to provide to people that may be looking at how do you diversify an agricultural environment? Is this forest that has been there for a long time, is it worth saving? Should we figure out some way to turn it into a preserve or something like that? So those are the major areas that I enjoy and that I work in for the most part.
Dr. Universe
Is it a lot more challenging to try to preserve things for insects because some people think they're creepy as opposed to cute, cuddly animals?
Rich Zack
Okay, so that is an excellent question. The answer I would have given you 20 years ago was probably yes. The answer today still is yes but less so because more individuals -- the general public level, the governmental level, the non governmental entities -- they're starting to realize the value. They've always looked at butterflies and stuff and said, "Oh, well, I understand. These are beautiful. People love to see them. So do we want to try to plant plants that encourage butterflies and stuff?"
The group that's really added to that recently is bees. Honeybees are important. We understand that. But what are all these other bees out there? What are they doing? Should we be doing something to preserve them? And in a kind of an odd way, honey bees led to that because we started to rely on honey bees so much, and honey bees have these problems. It was like, "Well, why aren't we looking at native bees? And are native bees real good indicators of habitat change and all of that?" So, we really need to understand this group. So, among a lot of individuals, there's more and more of an appreciation today for maybe we really should start looking at insects. Yes.
Dr. Universe
I wonder how much technology and social media has contributed to that because I know that I'm in some social media groups that are for wasp enthusiasts.
Rich Zack
If you're a budding young entomologist, and you go online today, the amount of information you can gather is unbelievable. I mean, a 3rd or 4th grader could go out there, and learn so much by going to the sites like BugGuide, which is professional entomologists, amateur entomologist, everybody just contributing information to our overall knowledge.
So, you can see pictures. You can read stories. You can do all of this. And that would have never been available to, especially non-entomologist, realistically, just a few years ago. So, there is so much out there. So, yes, when I was a child, I may have gone to an entomology collection to look at something. And maybe some collections would have, you know, Saturday mornings where they would allow people to come in and they would show you how to do things. A child today can see all of that online. They can join groups online. They can go to meetings online. They could learn how to do all of this online. And the information that's available to them is first class. You know, there's some beautiful videos out there on how to do things and what to look at when you're looking for insects and how to photograph them. The amount of information is unbelievable.
Dr. Universe
And you also do the museum at WSU as well, right?
Rich Zack
So, for a very, very long time I curated the insect collection there. I still am very involved in the collection. But I no longer have that official title as curator. We now actually have a full time curator in the collection. And over the last couple years, we've hired a few other entomologists. So, where for a long time, it was a one-person operation, now we've actually got four individuals that you could say are really hands-on in the insect collection.
Dr. Universe
And so that's like any other kind of museum, but the artifacts are insects.
Rich Zack
Yes, a lot of the insect collections, we refer to them as research collections. So, if you come in, there will be cabinets, and the cabinets have boxes and stuff. And they're all filled with insects. We don't have traditional displays like you might see at a public natural history museum. We do a lot of education outreach, though, through school groups that come in, through other groups, through us going to places -- you know, during the summer, we may go to some parks and recs types of things, county fairs, and then give presentations on insects.
So yes, we are a collection. If you go to the Smithsonian, the largest insect collection in the world, they have their beautiful displays and stuff. But then they have millions of insects in the back rooms that are in these drawers and cabinets that individuals from all over the world come to study.
Dr. Universe
So, did you always know that you wanted to be an entomologist?
Rich Zack
No, I always knew that I was interested in natural history. So as a kid, I liked to go out and look for salamanders and frogs and snakes and all of those types of things. I honestly did not know what entomology was until I got to Ohio State University. I hadn't started classes yet. I wanted to do something with lizards and snakes. I wanted to be a herpetologist. So, I went to the resident herpetologist and he said, "That's great. Boy, you know, I do salamanders. But you're gonna have a hard time making a living being a herpetologist. Have you ever thought of something different?" And he actually was a herpetologist on the side and an entomologist. He said, "Why don't you take an entomology class or two and see what that's like?"
And I did. I took general entomology, and I kind of started to think, "Wow, this is unbelievable." I knew insects, but I didn't know what they were doing and how many there were and the impact they have on everything that we do in our daily lives. And I took another class and then another class and then all of a sudden it was like, "Oh, I guess I majoring in entomology." Yeah, but I've enjoyed it ever since.
Dr. Universe
That's awesome. So you finished college, and then what happens after that?
Rich Zack
So, I finished my bachelor's degree. And then I thought, "Okay, if I really want to do research, if I really want to study, I need to go on to graduate school." And so I was encouraged by some individuals, and I found a graduate school to go to. I grew up in Ohio, so I went to Kent State University, which had a really great master's program. I learned there from an old fashioned, unbelievably great entomologist. So, after that, we talked a little bit and he said, "You know, I've never put a student here, but I hear good things about it. What about Washington State University?"
So, I applied and came to Washington State University. I took more years of studying insects and doing things. And then, kind of before I knew it, I had a doctorate in entomology, and it was time to get to work, I guess. Yeah.
Dr. Universe
That's amazing.
Rich Zack
I want to say something there. Because I didn't find this until I went to college. I was not an outstanding student in high school. I mean, I enjoyed biology. I got through chemistry. I got through physics. I can't say those were the classes that I really wanted to go to on a daily basis. But I think it's so important for young people especially to you know: don't give up on science. Don't think "I can't do this" just because maybe you don't get an A in physics. It doesn't mean you can't continue there.
There are so many different fields and things that will be available. And I think more often than not, you're going to find some group of animals or plants or whatever it is that really excite you. And then things change. You still may not be the best in physics and chemistry, but you may be the best in plant something. You may be the best in entomology. I never liked studying little things I couldn't see. But maybe you do like that. And you'd be a great, I don't know, protozoologist or something.
Dr. Universe
What is the best part of your job?
Rich Zack
So, the best part of my job is that I am doing something that I enjoy. I still love to go out and find new things about insects and see what they're doing and see how they live. The other part of my job that I've really enjoyed is teaching the next generation. I really enjoy working with undergraduate students. I enjoy encouraging them. Graduate students, you train them, and they're going to learn something, and they're going to take that on. Undergrads, they're kind of like, "Okay, how do we develop that interest? How do we keep that? How do we ooh and aah them so they think this is really neat and they want to go on?" So, I enjoy the teaching aspect. I enjoy working with, you know, I call them all young people, but I enjoy working with young people.
Dr. Universe
Do you have any funny stories?
Rich Zack
I don't know if they're funny. I have an insect net that I collect things with, and I would use the end of that insect net to turn over like cow pies and rocks so that I didn't get stung by scorpions. But then I would reach under rocks and get stung by scorpions. I remember once I was trying to get through some wiring or something with my net, and it turned out to be an electrified wire. And it shocked me. I broken fingers by falling off of bridges while I was trying to hunt my way along to get to someplace where there was a great pond or something. I've fallen into ponds trying to collect in those. And I think those are stories that everyone can tell.
Dr. Universe
One of the things that I love the most about entomology is that lots of different kinds of people can do it. Like, it's not even just professional entomologists. People who do entomology just for fun -- as a hobby -- can also contribute. Can we talk a little bit about advice you might have for kids who want to get started now?
Rich Zack
You bring up some good points. And entomology is kind of a cheap-person science. Because, at the lowest levels, you can go out and you can just sit in the grass. And you can watch ants. Ants do wonderful things. I mean, you can learn so much biology by watching ants follow each other and touch each other. And, "Oh, why are they touching each other? Oh, they're actually talking to each other through chemicals, not, you know, voices and stuff like that." So it's very simple to do those types of things.
I've always enjoyed collecting insects. You need a little bit of equipment and the right types of pins and stuff, and you can make a really nice insect collection. Today, a lot of people are into photographing, and you can do that with your cell phone. Or you can buy $10,000 worth of beautiful lenses and stuff. So you can do it at any level. And all of that can be done by professionals or certainly by what we call amateurs. An amateur can be anyone from a young child to one of my very good friends is a radiologist. And he probably is one of the moth experts in the United States, and yet he makes his living as a medical doctor.
There are some really great books out there that you can get that explain things at kind of an elementary level to get you involved in that. You can get online and look for mentors that want to maybe work with you a little bit and they'll tell you how to do things. And, again, it's very inexpensive. You know, get a jar and put some insects in it and watch what those insects do. And you can learn so much. And beyond that, throughout entomological history, many of the contributions have been made by amateur entomologist, not necessarily professional entomologist at all levels. Yes.
Dr. Universe
Do you have a favorite insect or arthropod?
Rich Zack
You know, it depends on the day. So my research group that I kind of grew up with is a large group of small flies called shore flies. They live along aquatic habitats, so streams and ponds. But they are very interesting biologically because they are a group of insects that have evolved to tolerate very harsh environments. So, if you go down to the Great Salt Lake or any other alkaline or saline lakes, and you look in there, there will often be thousands of these little larvae wriggling around. They are shore fly larvae. They are the only larvae that have developed a mechanism to tolerate that salinity. If you go to Yellowstone National Park and look in the hot springs, there will be shore fly larvae in those hotsprings at 45 degrees centigrade, which other animals can't tolerate that. And so I kind of always enjoyed this group, because they just did things so differently -- and that is my main group.
But I work on moths. One of the things I've done over my many years here in the Northwest is tried to document moth diversity. So, right now I have a graduate student, and we're working up on Fairchild Air Force Base outside of Spokane, and we're documenting the moths of Fairchild Air Force Base. We're also looking at bees up there. So, I guess I'd still have to say, just based on my early days, that the shore flies are really interesting. You know, they're little flies, no one would ever look at those.
If people want to look up things like Luna moths. They're unbelievably beautiful types of insects. There's another group of what we call giants silk moths that are beautiful types of insects. The other thing you can do is buy a magnifying glass, and go out and look at flies and beetles and little things. And you will discover how beautiful they are with the colors and the patterns and things that you would never see. You can do that with a $5 magnifying glass, and you'll see beauty in those insects for sure.
If you're into mythology, and you can look at the insects there. I'm a big Lord of the Rings fan. And my friends who watch that say, "Oh, well think about that movie for a little bit. Where did you see insects? What did Gandalf use when he needed to communicate with the eagles and stuff? He uses the moth. And that's traditional in Native American culture and other cultures where moths are messengers to individuals from the gods and stuff. So there is so much you can do out there, depending on what your interests are.
Dr. Universe
I love that connection, too. Is there anything else that you wanted to talk about?
Rich Zack
I really want to encourage: if you're interested, then pursue it. And don't give up, especially because you don't think you're good enough. Okay, you're good enough. And just because maybe you're not the greatest in chemistry or you're not the greatest in physics, there still will be places for you in science. So don't give up. Don't give up.
Dr. Universe
There's a place in entomology for everybody.
Rich Zack
There really is. Yeah, there really is.
Dr. Universe
That's all for this episode, friends. Big thanks to Rich Zack for giving us a window into entomology.
As always, if you've got a question for me, you can submit it at askdruniverse.wsu.edu. That's a s k d r u n i v e r s e dot w s u dot e d u. Who knows where your questions will take us next.